Renewed my site

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Renewed my site

Ruud
Hallo allemaal,
 
 
I just renewed my site. To be honest, not being an artist, I shamelessly
copied some of the layout of André's site. I hope you don't mind André, if
you do, please tell me.
 
I heard that there are some tools that enable you to check your site for
brooken links. Can anybody give me some info/URL about this? Thanks!
 

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Re: Renewed my site

André Fachat

Hi Ruud,

> I just renewed my site. To be honest, not being an artist, I shamelessly
> copied some of the layout of André's site. I hope you don't mind André,

No problem, it is not so sophisticated at all.
(although I generate the HTML from some better semantically structured XML, which keeps the look-and-feel the same for (almost) all pages.

> I heard that there are some tools that enable you to check your site for
> brooken links. Can anybody give me some info/URL about this? Thanks!

I think I have one - on my other computer. will send later.

André

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Re: Renewed my site

André Fachat
In reply to this post by Ruud

Hi Ruud,

> I just renewed my site. To be honest, not being an artist, I shamelessly

nice looking site! Especially lots of stuff I never knew about!

What is the status of the self-built 6502 (TTL6502?)? Sometimes it is not clear (to me) what the status of the projects is.

What about the EC8032? How can it actually display 80 columns, looking at the schematics of the video board it seems a standard setup that can display 80 columns only at 2MHz bus clock, but not 1MHz.

> I heard that there are some tools that enable you to check your site for
> brooken links. Can anybody give me some info/URL about this? Thanks!

I use "checklink". I thought it would come with openSUSE, but obviously I installed it myself on my previous installation (since updated to SUSE 10.2). You get on http://validator.w3.org/checklink (use the download link). That reminds me I should check my pages again myself :-)

André


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RE: Renewed my site

ruud.baltissen
Hallo André,


> (although I generate the HTML from some better semantically
> structured XML, which keeps the look-and-feel the same for
> (almost) all pages.

I made a template that I use to create new pages. I also made a small program written in Turbo Pascal that enables me to replace text in all my files in one run.
 

> What is the status of the self-built 6502 (TTL6502?)?

This was a project I was working on during some breaks at work. Unfortunately the drive of my PC crashed and, not keeping private stuff on the companies network thus no back-up, I lost quite some work :( I didn't mind that because I thought that I had updated my site already with the new stuff. Only last week I noticed I hadn't :(((


> Sometimes it is not clear (to me) what the status of the projects is.

This project has a very low priority. Main reason: it involves a lot of soldering and I don't have that much free time, certainly with all those other nice projects I have laying around (or things like updating some of my pages).


> What about the EC8032? How can it actually display 80
> columns, looking at the schematics of the video board it
> seems a standard setup that can display 80 columns only at
> 2MHz bus clock, but not 1MHz.

I'm not sure if I understand your question. Anyway, what my site doesn't mention yet, the original Elektor card has to changed a bit and that means indeed, IIRC, that some part runs at 2 MHz. FYI, I simply compared the schematic of the video part of the 8032 with the one of Elektor and adjusted things where needed. And that were only four or five things IIRC.


> http://validator.w3.org/checklink (use the download link).

Thanks!


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Re: Renewed my site

Marko Mäkelä-3
On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 08:30:08AM +0100, [hidden email] wrote:
> > What is the status of the self-built 6502 (TTL6502?)?
>
> This was a project I was working on during some breaks at work.
> Unfortunately the drive of my PC crashed and, not keeping private stuff
> on the companies network thus no back-up, I lost quite some work :(

Does company policy forbid you from carrying an USB flash memory with you?
Or keeping an encrypted copy of your private stuff on the company network?

I'd consider using a revision control system even for private projects.
Subversion <http://subversion.tigris.org/> is very nice, because the
repository can be on a local filesystem (fsfs) or on an HTTP server.  If
you choose FSFS, it's very nice for doing incremental backups (e.g.,
with rsync <http://rsync.samba.org/> to another hard disk or over the
network), because commits never modify existing files (unlike earlier
revision control systems, such as RCS and CVS).

        Marko

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Re: Renewed my site

Spiro Trikaliotis
Hello,

* On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 10:40:39AM +0200 Marko Mäkelä wrote:
 
> I'd consider using a revision control system even for private projects.
> Subversion <http://subversion.tigris.org/> is very nice, because the
> repository can be on a local filesystem (fsfs) or on an HTTP server.

CVS can operate on a local filesystem, too. ;) The http server is
"problematic", but IIRC, this is possible, too.

Anyway, I would never use it this way. ssh is the only remote access I
trust.

> If you choose FSFS, it's very nice for doing incremental backups
> (e.g., with rsync <http://rsync.samba.org/> to another hard disk or
> over the network), because commits never modify existing files (unlike
> earlier revision control systems, such as RCS and CVS).

rsync does a very good job sync'ing CVS repositories, too.

I don't advocate using CVS; I just want to point out that the arguments
above are not sufficient to prefer SVN over CVS, IMHO.

Personally, I do not like binary formats (as SVN uses it) very much, not
to speak about databases. ;) If something goes wrong (mostly user
error), if it is really needed, I can edit the CVS repository by hand -
I have done this more than once, especially when I started using CVS.  A
CVS repository is nothing more than some RCS files in directories, and
the RCS file format is very good documented. With SVN, this is not
possible.

I have seen some SVN repository bailout, where everything was lost
(only the backup helped). This was with some 1.0.x version.
Additionally, you might want to read the ChangeLogs for SVN - they are
very interesting. :)

Regards,
   Spiro.

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Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Marko Mäkelä-3
On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 06:23:51PM +0100, Spiro Trikaliotis wrote:
> CVS can operate on a local filesystem, too. ;) The http server is
> "problematic", but IIRC, this is possible, too.

Actually, the Subversion over HTTP or HTTPS can be hard to set up, since
it requires a special Apache module that implements part of the WebDAV
protocol.  On the other hand, this can be worth the trouble if you are
working in a place that blocks ssh access to the outside.  HTTP and
HTTPS are usually allowed, at least through a proxy.

> Anyway, I would never use it this way. ssh is the only remote access I
> trust.

Right, I wouldn't ever trust an unencrypted protocol (such as CVS pserver)
for non-anonymous access either.  If I had to use CVS, I'd pipe it over ssh.
Also Subversion and rsync can be piped over ssh.

> > If you choose FSFS, it's very nice for doing incremental backups
> > (e.g., with rsync <http://rsync.samba.org/> to another hard disk or
> > over the network), because commits never modify existing files (unlike
> > earlier revision control systems, such as RCS and CVS).
>
> rsync does a very good job sync'ing CVS repositories, too.

But if the transfer is aborted for some reason, you will end up having
the remote copy in a severely inconsistent state.  In Subversion fsfs,
commit writes two new files (properties and tree diffs) and edits one
file (the one that points to the most recent revision).

Also, in case the file system containing your master repository becomes
corrupted for whatever reason, if you do "rsync -n" first to see what
needs to be copied, with Subversion fsfs you'll get alerted if you see
any changes to old files.  With CVS, changes to old files are normal,
and you would be less likely to notice this.  So, you will have to
preserve old backed-up versions of the CVS repository to be sure that
nothing is corrupted.

> Personally, I do not like binary formats (as SVN uses it) very much, not
> to speak about databases. ;) If something goes wrong (mostly user
> error), if it is really needed, I can edit the CVS repository by hand -
> I have done this more than once, especially when I started using CVS.

Me too.  With Subversion fsfs, you can just delete the two new files per
revision and tweak the third file (it's plain text).

> CVS repository is nothing more than some RCS files in directories, and
> the RCS file format is very good documented. With SVN, this is not
> possible.

Right, you cannot edit Subversion repositories on the file level like
the ,v files of RCS and CVS, but you can edit them on the tree revision
level.  There even exists a command for editing tree properties (such as
svn:log, the change notes of a revision).  But for editing the diffs,
you are pretty much limited to deleting the most recent revision(s) and
recommitting the changes.  Not something that you'd do in a multi-user
environment.  But then again, editing a RCS or CVS repository by hand
is not usually a good idea either.

I find it great that Subversion commits are truly atomic.  Also, you can
rename and remove files and directories without having "Attic" directories
appear all over the repository.

> I have seen some SVN repository bailout, where everything was lost
> (only the backup helped). This was with some 1.0.x version.
> Additionally, you might want to read the ChangeLogs for SVN - they are
> very interesting. :)

I switched from CVS (after almost 10 years of using it) to Subversion in
late 2005, so I didn't have to deal with the potential horrors of the
original BDB-backed Subversion.  I know of one company that has all its
documents and source code in a single Subversion fsfs repository, tens
if not hundreds of thousands of revisions.  And surprisingly, it works
for them.

Of course, no system is perfect.  To get back on topic, I wonder what
system Commodore used for managing source code.  Perhaps just the
version-numbered files of VMS?  (I presume they used VAX/VMS at least
for some pre-Amiga development.  I remember seeing cbmvax.commodore.com
on the Usenet.)

        Marko

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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Ullrich von Bassewitz

On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 10:20:00PM +0200, Marko Mäkelä wrote:
> I switched from CVS (after almost 10 years of using it) to Subversion in
> late 2005, so I didn't have to deal with the potential horrors of the
> original BDB-backed Subversion.

Do you have experience with converting CVS repositories to SVN? I have
introduced SVN in our company a year ago, but I'm still using CVS at home.
I've been thinking about moving to SVN at home, because of the many
advantages, but I fear loosing my version history.

Regards


        Uz


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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Marko Mäkelä-3
On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 09:46:49PM +0100, Ullrich von Bassewitz wrote:
>
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 10:20:00PM +0200, Marko Mäkelä wrote:
> > I switched from CVS (after almost 10 years of using it) to Subversion in
> > late 2005, so I didn't have to deal with the potential horrors of the
> > original BDB-backed Subversion.
>
> Do you have experience with converting CVS repositories to SVN?

I haven't converted any CVS repository to SVN myself, but at work we
had one CVS repository that I believe was converted with cvs2svn
<http://cvs2svn.tigris.org/>.

The challenge with the conversion is how to detect which commits belong
together (because CVS commits each modified file separately while
Subversion commits the whole tree at once).

My colleague who did the conversion at work said that there is some way
to specify a threshold.  For example, if files have been committed less
than n minutes apart, they belong to the same commit (or changeset).
Of course, this rule won't work at all times.  You could have committed
unrelated small changes to several files quickly, or you might have been
interrupted for a few hours while you were typing change log messages
for the individual files in a large "cvs commit".

> I've been thinking about moving to SVN at home, because of the many
> advantages, but I fear loosing my version history.

If I were you, I'd give cvs2svn a try (fiddle with the parameters until
the outcome is satisfactory) and keep a backup of the original repository
just in case.

Well, I must confess that I didn't generally use any version control
for private projects until last year.  I have used RCS, CVS, BitKeeper
and Subversion at work.  I've had the least trouble with Subversion.

        Marko

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RE: Renewed my site

ruud.baltissen
In reply to this post by Marko Mäkelä-3
Hallo Marko,


> Does company policy forbid you from carrying an USB flash
> memory with you?

No, but our NT4 systems don't support USB anyway. But the file fitted on a floppy anyway, so storage wasn't the problem. And I regulary copied it to update my file at home. But it seems something must have gone wrong there too. I'm treasurer of a local computer club and yesterday I found out that the bookkeeping I made in the beginning of 2006 was missing as well. My habbit to make several copies saved my day. But this incident made me check out other things as well and I found out a severe error in the settings of my back-up program.
These settings are corrected now and with the help of some back-ups on CD I corrected some others minor items as well.


> Or keeping an encrypted copy of your private stuff on the
> company network?

We now have some space for private things so I keep things there now. Encryption is not needed. Would only arouse suspicion IMHO.


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De informatie in dit e-mailbericht is vertrouwelijk en uitsluitend bestemd voor de geadresseerde. Wanneer u dit bericht per abuis ontvangt, verzoeken wij u contact op te nemen met de afzender per kerende e-mail. Verder verzoeken wij u in dat geval dit e-mailbericht te vernietigen en de inhoud ervan aan niemand openbaar te maken. Wij aanvaarden geen aansprakelijkheid voor onjuiste, onvolledige dan wel ontijdige overbrenging van de inhoud van een verzonden e-mailbericht, noch voor daarbij overgebrachte virussen.

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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Glenn Holmer
In reply to this post by Marko Mäkelä-3
On Thursday 11 January 2007 15:38, Marko Mäkelä wrote:
> > I've been thinking about moving to SVN at home, because of the many
> > advantages, but I fear loosing my version history.
>
> If I were you, I'd give cvs2svn a try (fiddle with the parameters
> until the outcome is satisfactory) and keep a backup of the original
> repository just in case.

We just switched from CVS to Subversion at work, the primary reason
being that in Subversion you can move things around and not lose
history.  I used cvs2svn and it worked beautifully; we still have
history going back seven years and all the branches and tags.

Now, since I like to code on my 64C and not use cross-compilers... if
only there were only some form of revision control for our little
machine!

--
Glenn Holmer (Q-Link: ShadowM)
http://www.lyonlabs.org/commodore/c64.html


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RE: Renewed my site

ruud.baltissen
In reply to this post by André Fachat
Hallo André,


> What about the EC8032? How can it actually display 80
> columns, looking at the schematics of the video board it
> seems a standard setup that can display 80 columns only at
> 2MHz bus clock, but not 1MHz.

The Elektor 6845 runs at 2 MHz, the 6845 of the 8032 at 1 MHz. But this 1 MHz signal is fed to address line A0 of the video-RAM as well. So, just like the video RAM of the Elektor card, it outputs two bytes every micro second.
But A0 being occupied by the 1 MHz signal, TA0 of the 6845 is connected to A1 of the RAM, Ta1 to A2 etc. etc. On the Elektor card TAx is connected to Ax. This simply meant quite some cutting and resoldering. But fortunately I received another system and now I have a spare board I can use for the operation.

But you being able to emulate a 4032, it shouldn't be that difficult to emaulate a 8032 IMHO.


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De informatie in dit e-mailbericht is vertrouwelijk en uitsluitend bestemd voor de geadresseerde. Wanneer u dit bericht per abuis ontvangt, verzoeken wij u contact op te nemen met de afzender per kerende e-mail. Verder verzoeken wij u in dat geval dit e-mailbericht te vernietigen en de inhoud ervan aan niemand openbaar te maken. Wij aanvaarden geen aansprakelijkheid voor onjuiste, onvolledige dan wel ontijdige overbrenging van de inhoud van een verzonden e-mailbericht, noch voor daarbij overgebrachte virussen.

Stichting Pensioenfonds ABP is gevestigd te Heerlen en ingeschreven bij de Kamer van Koophandel Zuid Limburg onder nummer: 41074000


The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be privileged. It may be read, copied and used only by the intended recipient. If you have received it in error, please contact the sender immediately by return e-mail; please delete in this case the e-mail and do not disclose its contents to any person. We don't accept liability for any errors, omissions, delays of receipt or viruses in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission.

Stichting Pensioenfonds ABP, having its registered office at Heerlen, is registered in the Traderegister of the Chamber of Commerce Zuid Limburg (Maastricht), the Netherlands, registration number: 41074000





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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

silverdr
In reply to this post by Ullrich von Bassewitz

On 2007-01-11, at 21:46, Ullrich von Bassewitz wrote:

>
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 10:20:00PM +0200, Marko Mäkelä wrote:
>> I switched from CVS (after almost 10 years of using it) to  
>> Subversion in
>> late 2005, so I didn't have to deal with the potential horrors of the
>> original BDB-backed Subversion.
>
> Do you have experience with converting CVS repositories to SVN? I have
> introduced SVN in our company a year ago, but I'm still using CVS  
> at home.
> I've been thinking about moving to SVN at home, because of the many
> advantages, but I fear loosing my version history.

We did it slightly different way. We didn't move the whole CVS  
revision history but backed the CVS completely up, frozen it and  
started afresh with SVN while keeping the frozen CVS up for about a  
year. After this year it's been backed up again and diffed with the  
old backup (to be on the safe side) and shut down as it became  
practically irrelevant anymore. In case of a remotely possible need  
for digging out some older revisions, which were stored still in CVS,  
there is always a possibility of restoring it. Until now it hasn't  
happened and I believe it won't happen possibly at all ;-)

Of course it depends on how quickly the changes are being introduced  
so YMMV. In case of a slower rate of introducing the changes it might  
be worth to consider some migration tools.





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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Ullrich von Bassewitz

On Fri, Jan 12, 2007 at 01:48:36PM +0100, [hidden email] wrote:
> We did it slightly different way. We didn't move the whole CVS
> revision history but backed the CVS completely up, frozen it and
> started afresh with SVN while keeping the frozen CVS up for about a
> year. After this year it's been backed up again and diffed with the
> old backup (to be on the safe side) and shut down as it became
> practically irrelevant anymore. In case of a remotely possible need
> for digging out some older revisions, which were stored still in CVS,
> there is always a possibility of restoring it. Until now it hasn't
> happened and I believe it won't happen possibly at all ;-)

I'm using CVS for private/business projects for more than 10 years now, and
I've checked in stuff that is even older than that. So the repository
documents my own programming history, and I would really regret loosing it.
Some day, when I'm an old man with a white beard, I'm going to show it to my
grandchildren and say "Look here, this is how your grandfather started
hacking":-)

cvs2svn, as mentioned by Marko, sounds like a possible solution, and I will
have a look at it once I have some spare time.

BTW: We are using TortoiseSVN in the company to access the subversion
repository. Unfortunately it is a Windows only client, but apart from that it
is really great. Even I - as a dedicated command line hacker - have to admit
that. Windows users may want to give it a try.

Regards


        Uz


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Re: Version control systems

Spiro Trikaliotis
Hello,

* On Fri, Jan 12, 2007 at 05:50:10PM +0100 Ullrich von Bassewitz wrote:
 
> cvs2svn, as mentioned by Marko, sounds like a possible solution, and I will
> have a look at it once I have some spare time.

cvs2svn has some problems. Anyway, from my experience, it either refuses
to convert the CVS at all, in which case it aborts with a clear error
message, or everything works fine. I never experienced (or heard of)
cvs2svn reporting success, but generating a broken SVN.

One example where svn2cvs bails out (at least, it did some time ago. I
don't know if this has been fixed, never checked for this): Some people
have created a tag to denote the trunk of CVS. For example, a tag TRUNK
with is set to revision 1. This way, it was possible to go back to the
trunk without needing to use "cvs up -A", which resets all other sticky
options, too.

Now, cvs2svn refused to do the conversion with such a tag, as cvs2svn
meant that such a tag was not allowed. In fact, this is a branch tag in
the RCS sense, not in the CVS sense. So, one could argue if this was
still a valid CVS repository. Anyway, CVS is able to generate it, thus,
IMHO, it should be considered a valid one.

I know there was some discussion if this should be fixed or not. As I
told, I did follow if it was fixed.

So, to make a long story short: From my experience, if cvs2svn ends
without an error report, it did a fairly good job in the conversion. Of
course, this does not mean I would throw away the CVS repository; but
backing it up might be good.

Regards,
   Spiro.

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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Spiro Trikaliotis
In reply to this post by Marko Mäkelä-3
Hello,

* On Thu, Jan 11, 2007 at 10:20:00PM +0200 Marko Mäkelä wrote:
 
> Right, I wouldn't ever trust an unencrypted protocol (such as CVS pserver)
> for non-anonymous access either.

I wouldn't even trust pserver for anonymous access, as long as the
pserver CVS does not ly on a separate machine and operates on a
read-only copy of the repository.

Even the CVS developers themselves always stress the fact that pserver
was never designed to be used in the public. There was no attempt to try
to protect it against any break-ins. In fact, many of the developers
even discourage using it in intranets.

 
> > rsync does a very good job sync'ing CVS repositories, too.
>
> But if the transfer is aborted for some reason, you will end up having
> the remote copy in a severely inconsistent state.

Why should be in "severely inconsistent state"? Some files have been
updates, some not. Anyway, no single file is wrong (due to the working
of rsync). I can still get any revision that is on the file not rsync'ed
yet. Doing another rsync fixes the problem immediately.

 
> Also, in case the file system containing your master repository becomes
> corrupted for whatever reason, if you do "rsync -n" first to see what
> needs to be copied, with Subversion fsfs you'll get alerted if you see
> any changes to old files.  With CVS, changes to old files are normal,
> and you would be less likely to notice this.

Well, yes, CVS stores tags in the files directly, thus, every file gets
changed when "cvs tag" is executed. Additionally, this is the reason why
tagging is so slow.

> So, you will have to preserve old backed-up versions of the CVS
> repository to be sure that nothing is corrupted.

Well, if you do not do keep backups, you have a problem anyways. Your
data should be worth it, isn't it?

BTW: Regarding the number of bugs which corrupt the Berkeley DB, I don't
think it is advisable to not keep many backups. THIS is my main concern
with SVN.

> > Personally, I do not like binary formats (as SVN uses it) very much, not
> > to speak about databases. ;) If something goes wrong (mostly user
> > error), if it is really needed, I can edit the CVS repository by hand -
> > I have done this more than once, especially when I started using CVS.
>
> Me too.  With Subversion fsfs, you can just delete the two new files per
> revision and tweak the third file (it's plain text).

But the two new files are binary, aren't they? I must admit I never used
fsfs myself, only Berkeley DB. In fact, most people I spoke about tell
me that Berkeley DB is the best solution. Is this wrong?

The bottomline: My arguments are all based on Berkeley DB.


> I find it great that Subversion commits are truly atomic.  Also, you can
> rename and remove files and directories without having "Attic" directories
> appear all over the repository.

I never said SVN does not have its own advantages. I like the atomicity,
too. I also like the possibilities with renamend and removing files. I
don't mind the "Attic/" directories in the repository, they don't do any
harm.

You might want to have a look at the thread at
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/info-cvs/2006-10/msg00084.html.

 
> I switched from CVS (after almost 10 years of using it) to Subversion in
> late 2005, so I didn't have to deal with the potential horrors of the
> original BDB-backed Subversion.  I know of one company that has all its
> documents and source code in a single Subversion fsfs repository, tens
> if not hundreds of thousands of revisions.  And surprisingly, it works
> for them.

Of course, SVN is mature until now. Nevertheless, I believe CVS (*not*
CVSNT!) to be "more mature" than SVN. Somehow, I have more sympathy to
the CVS/RCS file format. (I used RCS "by hand" more than 10 years ago.)

Regards,
   Spiro.

--
Spiro R. Trikaliotis                              http://opencbm.sf.net/
http://www.trikaliotis.net/                     http://www.viceteam.org/

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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Wolfgang Moser
Hello all,

my unworthy two cents to some aspect of this discussion.

Spiro Trikaliotis wrote:
> [...]
>
> Of course, SVN is mature until now. Nevertheless, I believe CVS (*not*
> CVSNT!) to be "more mature" than SVN. Somehow, I have more sympathy to
> the CVS/RCS file format. (I used RCS "by hand" more than 10 years ago.)

This sounds as if you are crying for some SVN control system that backs
to some XML format storage artefacts? Not neccessarily meant for beeing
human readable (or hackable) first and foremost, but to give it users
or administrators the feeling that they are not excluded from the
contents, as well as giving the usual platform interchangeble machine
readable meta descriptions.


This document:
    http://web.mit.edu/ghudson/info/fsfs
tells that SVN on FSFS gives already platform interchangability for the
back-end (since files can be transported easily), but it doesn't tell
about the concrete storage format.


Womo

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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

silverdr
In reply to this post by Spiro Trikaliotis

On 2007-01-12, at 22:38, Spiro Trikaliotis wrote:


> BTW: Regarding the number of bugs which corrupt the Berkeley DB,

Is that SO bad?! This format is in quite heavy use for ages now,  
especially in the BSD derivatives. How would it survive that long  
being so buggy as you suggest? I am asking, not challenging...

> I don't
> think it is advisable to not keep many backups. THIS is my main  
> concern
> with SVN.

Well, you don't have to go with Berkeley DB if that's your problem.  
SVN allows different backends these days.

>>> Personally, I do not like binary formats (as SVN uses it) very  
>>> much, not
>>> to speak about databases. ;) If something goes wrong (mostly user
>>> error), if it is really needed, I can edit the CVS repository by  
>>> hand -
>>> I have done this more than once, especially when I started using  
>>> CVS.
>>
>> Me too.  With Subversion fsfs, you can just delete the two new  
>> files per
>> revision and tweak the third file (it's plain text).
>
> But the two new files are binary, aren't they? I must admit I never  
> used
> fsfs myself, only Berkeley DB. In fact, most people I spoke about tell
> me that Berkeley DB is the best solution. Is this wrong?

It's been the most widely used for some time. Recent tendencies are  
for FSFS

[...]
> I never said SVN does not have its own advantages. I like the  
> atomicity,
> too. I also like the possibilities with renamend and removing files. I
> don't mind the "Attic/" directories in the repository, they don't  
> do any
> harm.

They are PITA for purists ;-)

What I still dislike in SVN, even after some time of getting used to  
it, is the revision numbering per _repository_ rather than per  
project. I prefer not to maintain a growing number of repositories  
while it's still confusing for many (especially new to SVN) people  
when they encounter xteen revisions of difference between their last  
commit and the current state, all e.g. with no apparent changes to  
their project contents.


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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

silverdr
In reply to this post by Ullrich von Bassewitz

On 2007-01-12, at 17:50, Ullrich von Bassewitz wrote:

> I'm using CVS for private/business projects for more than 10 years  
> now, and
> I've checked in stuff that is even older than that. So the repository
> documents my own programming history, and I would really regret  
> loosing it.
> Some day, when I'm an old man with a white beard, I'm going to show  
> it to my
> grandchildren and say "Look here, this is how your grandfather started
> hacking":-)

Of course! :-) Our (and mine) old CVS repositories are still  
preserved. It's just that they've been archived and taken off-line.

>
> cvs2svn, as mentioned by Marko, sounds like a possible solution,  
> and I will
> have a look at it once I have some spare time.
>
> BTW: We are using TortoiseSVN in the company to access the subversion
> repository. Unfortunately it is a Windows only client, but apart  
> from that it
> is really great. Even I - as a dedicated command line hacker - have  
> to admit
> that. Windows users may want to give it a try.

Partially similar thing is available for OS X. But I use it actually  
only to have an eye-candy and occasional alert when browsing file  
trees that something is in an unexpected state (forgot to commit?).  
Normally it's all command line here.

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Re: Version control systems (Re: Renewed my site)

Marko Mäkelä-3
On Sat, Jan 13, 2007 at 04:12:51PM +0100, [hidden email] wrote:
> >BTW: We are using TortoiseSVN in the company to access the subversion
> >repository. Unfortunately it is a Windows only client, but apart  
> >from that it is really great. Even I - as a dedicated command line
> >hacker - have to admit that. Windows users may want to give it a try.
>
> Partially similar thing is available for OS X. But I use it actually  
> only to have an eye-candy and occasional alert when browsing file  
> trees that something is in an unexpected state (forgot to commit?).  
> Normally it's all command line here.

This is drifting away from Commodores, but there is no need to leave
Emacs.  Although the file-based revision control commands do not work
with Subversion, M-x svn-status works rather nicely, especially the
command "E" to highlight changes in Emacs diff.  However, I usually
do commits on the command line, after carefully examining the output
of "svn status" and "svn diff".

> What I still dislike in SVN, even after some time of getting used to
> it, is the revision numbering per _repository_ rather than per
> project. I prefer not to maintain a growing number of repositories

I understand your pain, since we have a lot of branches in our main
repository at work.

However, there is not that much per-repository overhead in SVN, at least
if you use the FSFS backend.  At home, I have a separate repository for
each project (my home page, and various pieces of software).

        Marko

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