Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

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Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!

Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..

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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Francesco Messineo
On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 10:15 PM <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>
> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..

I use cbmlink with a parallel (Yes, I have lots of PCs with parallel
interface) to user port cable (I believe it's called PC48, it's on
cbmlink docs). It works for C64, VIC-20 and PETs (at least basic 2, no
1.0 or 1.1) with the same cable. I use mainly to copy programs to real
floppies or write .d64 images to a real floppy, but it can just
transfer a program to memory and it's very fast (unless of course you
do write on disk, in that case, it's very slow).
I think it's abandonware by now, but it works enough well for me. If
your friend isn't willing to spend some time making cables and trying
programs, he better gets an SD-based IEC disk, like sdiec or pi-1541.

Frank

> --
> SD! - https://e4aws.silverdr.com/
>
>

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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

André Fachat
In reply to this post by silverdr@wfmh.org.pl


Am 11. Januar 2019 22:17:22 schrieb [hidden email]:

> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on
> real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>
> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would
> you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real
> hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..

I use an xs1541 or a petSD with the XD2031 firmware.

André




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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
In reply to this post by Francesco Messineo


> On 2019-01-11, at 22:31, Francesco Messineo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 10:15 PM <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>>
>> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
>
> I use cbmlink with a parallel (Yes, I have lots of PCs with parallel
> interface) to user port cable (I believe it's called PC48, it's on
> cbmlink docs). It works for C64, VIC-20 and PETs (at least basic 2, no
> 1.0 or 1.1) with the same cable. I use mainly to copy programs to real
> floppies or write .d64 images to a real floppy, but it can just
> transfer a program to memory and it's very fast (unless of course you
> do write on disk, in that case, it's very slow).
> I think it's abandonware by now, but it works enough well for me. If
> your friend isn't willing to spend some time making cables and trying
> programs, he better gets an SD-based IEC disk, like sdiec or pi-1541.

He needs to run it off current machine (no parport) and he can of course get SDIEC or something similar but the problem is with transferring hundreds of times removing card, plugging in, saving, removing, pluggin in, loading, removi....

Ideally it should work similar to what I had:

lO on the 64, and

$ make tr (for test real) on the laptop, which builds the program and starts transfer

while the cable is connected all the time.

--
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
In reply to this post by André Fachat


> On 2019-01-11, at 22:42, André Fachat <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>>
>> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
>
> I use an xs1541 or a petSD with the XD2031 firmware.

But this works the other way around, right?

With it you connect CBM floppy to your modern machine, where modern machine acts as CBM. What he needs is that modern machine acts as storage (floppy, tape, ...) and a real C64 accesses it.

--
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

André Fachat


Am 11. Januar 2019 23:33:12 schrieb [hidden email]:

>> On 2019-01-11, at 22:42, André Fachat <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on
>>> real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>>>
>>> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would
>>> you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real
>>> hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
>>
>> I use an xs1541 or a petSD with the XD2031 firmware.
>
> But this works the other way around, right?
>
> With it you connect CBM floppy to your modern machine, where modern machine
> acts as CBM. What he needs is that modern machine acts as storage (floppy,
> tape, ...) and a real C64 accesses it.

No, the XD2031 firmware works as disk drive, with files in directories on a
PC, alternatively from disk images also on the PC. The connection is via
USB serial.

My mode of operation is as you described, assembling on the PC, load and
run from the PET. That's why I implemented XD2031. No mechanical drive
involved.

André

>




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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Groepaz
In reply to this post by silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
Am Freitag, 11. Januar 2019, 22:14:56 CET schrieb [hidden email]:
> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real
> hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>
> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you
> recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware,
> it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..

with the alternative/new firmware for rrnet-mk3 you can use tftp (and codenet
of course, which i find much more convenient for deving)

--

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http://vice-emu.sourceforge.net  http://magicdisk.untergrund.net

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architecture.
<Ben Scott>





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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Groepaz
Am Samstag, 12. Januar 2019, 08:31:23 CET schrieb [hidden email]:

> Am Freitag, 11. Januar 2019, 22:14:56 CET schrieb [hidden email]:
> > I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on
> > real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
> >
> > Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would
> > you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real
> > hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
>
> with the alternative/new firmware for rrnet-mk3 you can use tftp (and
> codenet of course, which i find much more convenient for deving)

oh forgot the link: https://svn.icomp.de/svn/rrnetmk3/trunk/

it will also work with all other incarnations of cs8900a based interfaces on
the c64.

what also wasnt mentioned: easyflash 3 - you can send programs via usb

similar functionality in the 1541U, and the chameleon :)

--

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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Kajtár Zsolt
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256


There's a true network drive implementation in IDEDOS for at least 14 years no
w.

http://www.ide64.org/cable.html

- --
                                                    -soci-
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl


> On 2019-01-12, at 11:07, Kajtár Zsolt <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
>
> There's a true network drive implementation in IDEDOS for at least 14 years no
> w.
>
> http://www.ide64.org/cable.html

Yes - but I doubt if my friend will be able to source an IDE64 device quickly. I'll write Josef and ask if he's got some. Might be a good moment because after moving, I can't any of mine either...

>
> - --
>    -soci-
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> =BDQR
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>

--
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
In reply to this post by Groepaz

> On 2019-01-12, at 08:41, [hidden email] wrote:
>
>
> oh forgot the link: https://svn.icomp.de/svn/rrnetmk3/trunk/
>
> it will also work with all other incarnations of cs8900a based interfaces on
> the c64.
>
> what also wasnt mentioned: easyflash 3 - you can send programs via usb

O! AFAIR that could be a great option too. It's just that I recall some compilation problems with the tool. Will need to check again. And if it can be compiled as a command line tool.

> similar functionality in the 1541U, and the chameleon :)

I don't have Chameleon to try but does 1541U have such option? I thought the USB there, with its type A socket wasn't meant for this.

--
SD! - http://e4aws.silverdr.com/


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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
In reply to this post by Groepaz

> On 2019-01-12, at 08:31, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> Am Freitag, 11. Januar 2019, 22:14:56 CET schrieb [hidden email]:
>> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real
>> hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>>
>> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you
>> recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware,
>> it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
>
> with the alternative/new firmware for rrnet-mk3 you can use tftp (and codenet
> of course, which i find much more convenient for deving)

This could also be interesting. Maybe even more than the other options. I never used it though. Does the 64 need to run some software before it gets the file(s) or does the cart take care of things even if the machine is on its startup screen only?

--
SD! - http://e4aws.silverdr.com/


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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
In reply to this post by André Fachat

> On 2019-01-12, at 01:01, André Fachat <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>>> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=> done!
>>>>
>>>> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
>>>
>>> I use an xs1541 or a petSD with the XD2031 firmware.
>>
>> But this works the other way around, right?
>>
>> With it you connect CBM floppy to your modern machine, where modern machine acts as CBM. What he needs is that modern machine acts as storage (floppy, tape, ...) and a real C64 accesses it.
>
> No, the XD2031 firmware works as disk drive, with files in directories on a PC, alternatively from disk images also on the PC. The connection is via USB serial.
>
> My mode of operation is as you described, assembling on the PC, load and run from the PET. That's why I implemented XD2031. No mechanical drive involved.

<thumbsup> He'd need to get the xs1541 and flash it with your firmware. I'll see if he can get something for codenet, which looks like most interesting option and if not we'll fall back to other possibilities.

--
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Groepaz
In reply to this post by silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
Am Samstag, 12. Januar 2019, 12:49:31 CET schrieb [hidden email]:

> > On 2019-01-12, at 08:41, [hidden email] wrote:
> >
> >
> > oh forgot the link: https://svn.icomp.de/svn/rrnetmk3/trunk/
> >
> > it will also work with all other incarnations of cs8900a based interfaces
> > on the c64.
> >
> > what also wasnt mentioned: easyflash 3 - you can send programs via usb
>
> O! AFAIR that could be a great option too. It's just that I recall some
> compilation problems with the tool. Will need to check again. And if it can
> be compiled as a command line tool.
> > similar functionality in the 1541U, and the chameleon :)
>
> I don't have Chameleon to try but does 1541U have such option? I thought the
> USB there, with its type A socket wasn't meant for this.

with 1541U you use ethernet for this

--

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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Groepaz
In reply to this post by silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
Am Samstag, 12. Januar 2019, 12:54:20 CET schrieb [hidden email]:

> > On 2019-01-12, at 08:31, [hidden email] wrote:
> >
> > Am Freitag, 11. Januar 2019, 22:14:56 CET schrieb [hidden email]:
> >> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things on
> >> real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>, <C=>
> >> done!
> >>
> >> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would
> >> you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real
> >> hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..
> >
> > with the alternative/new firmware for rrnet-mk3 you can use tftp (and
> > codenet of course, which i find much more convenient for deving)
>
> This could also be interesting. Maybe even more than the other options. I
> never used it though. Does the 64 need to run some software before it gets
> the file(s) or does the cart take care of things even if the machine is on
> its startup screen only?

the c64 needs to run software (of course) - that software is the mentioned
firmware :) to use it you hold some key at reset/poweron.

--

http://hitmen.eu                 http://ar.pokefinder.org
http://vice-emu.sourceforge.net  http://magicdisk.untergrund.net

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swimming pool.
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl

> On 2019-01-12, at 13:26, [hidden email] wrote:
>
>>> with the alternative/new firmware for rrnet-mk3 you can use tftp (and
>>> codenet of course, which i find much more convenient for deving)
>>
>> This could also be interesting. Maybe even more than the other options. I
>> never used it though. Does the 64 need to run some software before it gets
>> the file(s) or does the cart take care of things even if the machine is on
>> its startup screen only?
>
> the c64 needs to run software (of course)

Theoretically I can imagine that the cart takes over when a valid transmission comes in, does a form of DMA and returns control to KERNAL/BASIC once ready.

> - that software is the mentioned
> firmware :) to use it you hold some key at reset/poweron.

I see, tnx.

--
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
In reply to this post by Groepaz

> On 2019-01-12, at 13:25, [hidden email] wrote:
>
>>> oh forgot the link: https://svn.icomp.de/svn/rrnetmk3/trunk/
>>>
>>> it will also work with all other incarnations of cs8900a based interfaces
>>> on the c64.
>>>
>>> what also wasnt mentioned: easyflash 3 - you can send programs via usb
>>
>> O! AFAIR that could be a great option too. It's just that I recall some
>> compilation problems with the tool. Will need to check again. And if it can
>> be compiled as a command line tool.
>>> similar functionality in the 1541U, and the chameleon :)
>>
>> I don't have Chameleon to try but does 1541U have such option? I thought the
>> USB there, with its type A socket wasn't meant for this.
>
> with 1541U you use ethernet for this

Ah, mine doesn't have ethernet but that makes sense.
--
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smf
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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

smf
On 12/01/2019 12:55, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> Ah, mine doesn't have ethernet but that makes sense.

I think the 1541u2 has support for a specific USB to ethernet adapter, I
bought one when it was first announced that gideon was supporting it but
things got in the way of me trying it when he released the firmware that
supports it.

You're probably out of luck if you have an original 1541u


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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

Per Olofsson-2
In reply to this post by silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
Den Fre 11 jan 2019 kl 22:14 skrev [hidden email]:
> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What would
> you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software on real
> hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of times..

I'd go for EasyFlash 3 with a USB cable:

  http://skoe.de/easyflash/doku.php?id=usbfiletransfer

--
  Per Olofsson
  [hidden email]

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Re: Easy way to use contemporary machine as fileserver for C64

MiaM
In reply to this post by silverdr@wfmh.org.pl
Den Fri, 11 Jan 2019 22:14:56 +0100 skrev [hidden email]:
> I remember I used Marko's C2N232 some time ago to load'n test things
> on real hardware - worked fantastic back then: <SHIFT><RUN/STOP>,
> <C=> done!
>
> Now I have a friend who's got similar need but has no C2N232. What
> would you recommend to use instead? As this is for testing software
> on real hardware, it needs to be loaded tens if not hundreds of
> times..

I can think of two solutions not already mentioned in this thread. I
haven't tested any of them, but can't see any reason for them to not
work.

A)
A setup with a Pi1541 with some kind of dual boot, which boots the Pi
in a minimal standard Linux system with network support to access the
files on the SD card from a PC, and then reboot the Pi with the Pi1541
software to access it from a C64.

B)
ZoomFloppy / Xum1541 with a VIC switch and a real drive and/or SD2IEC.
Beware of the fast loader issues with VIC switch though. (As seen on
this list, there were an updated VIC switch which support the C128
burst mode).

C)
(This might very well fail) SD2IEC together with one of those strange
memory cards with bult in Wifi which are intended for usage in digital
cameras to immediately transfer pictures from the camera to a computer
via Wifi. Not sure what file systems and what operations they support,
but as most cameras and also SD2IEC uses FAT32 (afaik).

P.S. The XS1541 mentioned previously in this thread seems to
technically be the best solution.

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